A study group from the International Downtown Association and a national consulting company, Carl Walker Inc., are looking this week at parking in uptown Charlotte. They’re holding stakeholder meetings today and tomorrow, and then Wednesday will present some recommendations.
Turns out some cities have a parking services manager, or a parking management division in their transportation departments. Other cities have private, nonprofits groups that oversee parking management. Charlotte doesn’t.
Here’s some of what they were asking a workshop group this morning about parking uptown. Feel free to offer your own thoughts in the comments section (below):
– Is finding parking uptown a real problem, or a perception problem, or some of both?
– Do people have a hard time finding where the parking lots and parking decks are?
– Does fear of not finding a parking spot keep people from going uptown?
– How much difference does the lack of uniform signage make, or the lack of uniform pricing and ticket validation rules?
– How much of a problem, if any, is the so-called “Cinderella parking” – spots that magically appear or vanish, based on whatever day of the week it is, or whether there’s an event at the Bobcats Arena?
– What’s the going rate for monthly parking? When the moderator, David Feehan, president of the International Downtown Association, asked the crowd that, hardly anyone piped up with numbers. I began to suspect people who own parking lots/decks may not like their rates revealed.
– Do you have any uptown parking secrets you’d like to share?
I’ll share my “secrets.” I figure word will get out anyway so what the heck.
One: Park free for 90 minutes underneath ImaginOn, if you validate your ticket upstairs. Enter off Sixth Street. I’m honest, though. I’ve used it only when I had business at ImaginOn.
Two: Park up to 90 minutes at Seventh Street Station (enter off Sixth or Seventh streets), even during those expensive Event Parking Nights, if you buy something at Reid’s and get your ticket validated. It so happens that Reid’s is one of the few places here selling Blue Bonnet brand ice cream, about which Johnny Apple raved in the New York Times’ food section recently. So ...
Monday, August 21, 2006
Uptown parking: Sound off
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37 comments:
Parking Uptown is HORRIBLE. For those working uptown, prices range from $50 (if you want to walk 6-10 blocks to the center of town) to over $150, if you can afford it, to park in covered parking in some of the buildings. Also some buildings kick you out on special event days if you are not a monthly parker. For those who must drive due to their working hours, and can't use CATS due to the limited bus schedules in some parts of town (where only 2 buses in the morning and 2 in the evenings service the areas we live) parking takes a huge chunk of our paychecks !!!
Details about how much employees at certain companies pay for parking are EXTREMELY interesting.
What we pay at The Observer versus what Wachovia people pay is amazing. And would love to know more about policies for folks who don't use the parking everyone else uses -- like bikers and bus riders -- for specific companies.
Who in town provides the best parking rates to employees, or encourages employees the most to avoid driving to work? We know Bank of America offers to help people buy Priuses: do they also reward employees who can't afford Priuses but who take a bus or ride a bike instead?
Parking uptown is ridiculous. I used to park a block and a half from the BOA Corporate Center (where I work) at a rate of $175/month (covered walkway indoors). That parking deck went "tenant only" so now I am stuck walking 5 blocks to work for $125/month. I'd pay more if I could get closer parking (up to $200/month), but I know what I can pay is much too expensive for most people and can really eat into the paycheck. Thus far, public transportation is NOT an option due to limited availability and erratic working hours.
I never had a problem parking Uptown other than the door dings I would get parking in the narrow spaces of seventh street station.
For the people who complain about the cost of parking during working hours you have to ask yourself a few questions. You knew the job was in Uptown, you knew you would probably need to drive, you knew a general amount of what it would cost to park and where it would be and you knew how much the job paid. So if you didn't take into consideration what the added costs to taking that job in Uptown than that is totally your fault. Nobody forced you to take that job in Uptown.
The city feels they need better signage then they should charge each of the deck owners a charge to put their names on the directional signs. Just like the blue one's used on the highways to tell drivers whats off that exit.
We used to come downtown after work for drinks and dinner and would either park at the meters or at 7th St. Station where they offered 90 min. free parking. Now, it's not offered after 5:00, and many of the meters are either blocked or have been completely removed (Church St. between 6th and Trade). Bad decision because now we only go to places away from town that have free parking. I like downtown but not if I have to pay $5 or more to park for a couple of hours. Also, I'm not comfortable walking back to my car after dark in a parking deck.
I have never had a problam finding parking uptown. I don't work uptown, but I do frequent certain events at night such as Bobcat games, Center City After Five, etc. Even during Speed Street, I never had an issue. Do I have a favorite spot? Yes. It's only $3 if you enter after 5:30, and free if you leave after 10:30-11 (the attendent only stays so long). Look around, maybeyou'll find it.
It is amazing that the city ever bags meters anywhere downtown for any reason. What a waste of perfectly good parking, especially durring events. There needs to be much, much more on-street parking, clearly labeled and always available.
I guess since they bag the meters in the name of "security" we should just accept it since questioning "security" no matter how misguided and ineffective the acts are is unpatriotic and "helping the terrorists."
I work at BofA and they do offer incentives to employees that use public transportation or bike commute. I don't have a problem with parking and view the 8-block walk as a nice release from dealing with traffic or dealing with my day. If I come back on the weekends to go out, I either valet or go to a bar that validates parking. There are a lot of places that will validate your parking, call and ask to find out which ones do.
I just moved to Charlotte from Washington, D.C. -- you want to talk about serious parking issues. Although I will admit, parking in uptown is not what I expected from a city of Charlotte's size. At least in D.C. you can find clearly marked street parking as well as clearly marked public garages. I am amazed that you have to "hunt" for a garage and then as you are turning into the garage you realize it's monthly only or full or restricted in some other way. My one huge plus with Charlotte parking however is the price. It cost a minimum of $20 to park for AN HOUR in D.C. and at least $50-$60 per day (now I know someone will say that's not true, well yes it might be exagerated in that you can find cheaper parking in D.C. --if you want to get mugged walking to and from your car and have your car stolen in the process). So for those paying $50 per month, you might want to rethink your gripping and remember that some people are paying that per day!
Uptown parking is just one more thing the anti-arena leadership and voters were right on. It used to be you could park on the street, or in many lots and decks, after work or on weekends for free. The lot owners could easily keep track of the 8 Panthers home games (10 including preseason) and charge those days. Now with 45 basketball games they don't want to bother checking the calendar and just charge every day and every night. And people just aren't spending $5-$10 to park near a nightclub and then another $5-10 at another nightclub if the first one isn't "happening". Already Palomino has gone out of business - how many more idiot restaurant and bar owners who clamored for the arena (or just drank too much Chamber Kool-Aid) are going to go under?
I work uptown but take the bus when I can, so that precludes a lot of problems and expense.
My biggest gripe with parking comes when I'm working during off-hours, such as evenings or weekends, and the bus schedule is too abbreviated to be of much use. Too many spaces on the street are made unavailable. This is primarily due to either construction or special events. Is there some reason that spaces are blocked off on Friday evening for a Sunday afternoon Panthers game? Or that a fenced-in construction site that is dormant over the weekend can't have cars parked along the road outside?
Looking at the broader picture, I'm skeptical of any policy change that can alleviate the growing shortage of parking. Thare are more people working and living uptown every year, and less open ground-level space that is essential for cheap parking.
Pay up.
I stopped going to dinner in "uptown" since the Arena opened. There is simply NO PARKING on the street anywhere. This WAS a huge convenience before but now with the Arena, it seems everyone wants $10 to park. The uptown area is going backwards as far as parking goes...
I also moved here from the Northeast (originally from outside Boston). Parking here is not bad at all. I go uptown for events or the occasional night out and have no problem. It usually only cost $10 bucks or so if I have to pay at all. Very reasonable based on past experiences.
One way to solve the parking 'problem' for folks that work at the banks is to build a light rail and ecourage people to ride it thus reducing the need for uptown parking in the first place.
Building light rail and encouraging riding won't work when you have to find parking along the light rail line. That will be the next parking obstacle!
Being a Charlotte native I used to go uptown all the time and park for free. I do not frequent uptown now that I have to park. I find it truly outrageous that if I want to go to Dixie's for instance, they charge $5 to park in THEIR LOT at night! Why in the world would I want to pay to park to go eat at a restaurant when there are so many other places I can park for free! They are nuts!!!! We need to get back to free parking. There are many more like me who won't pay for parking.
I moved to Charlotte from Charleston where parking is a bloodsport. I don't work Uptown and although I live in Dilworth, I try to avoid going because its just too difficult to find convenient spaces. Great prospects are always bagged for some reason no one ever knows about. Garages don't advertise their availibility well enough and ripoffs are rampant. During events in Gateway Village its not unusual to see two garages opposite each other with one going for $5 all filled and the other $15 a day. Parking in downtown Charleston is migraine inducing but at least there are clearly identifiable options and you don't have to spend half the day circling, cursing, wasting gas and craning your neck into garages trying to figure out if its "private" or not.
As long as people have to pay to park, forget retail in uptown.
Jeesh, people, this is not Chicago or New York. If parking somewhere to shop, dine, etc. is even REMOTELY inconvenient or costs money, there are countless alternative.
If the city were smart and wanted to boost uptown, they would build 10,000 free parking spaces.
Even that, I fear, would not be enough.
It is still easier to park and shop/dine at South Park, and any new mall that is popping up here and there.
And you don't have to deal with the hood rats in South Park.
Paying for parking is a complete joke, not to mention unfair to the poor.
But no doubt the parking lot ownwers lobby (preferred parking, etc) is just another for-profit business group that has city council and McCrory in their hip pocket.
A short story. My family met me for lunch one day at the green. They parked at a meter.
We were no more than 5 minutes late back to the meter (we had put money in) and were slapped with a $25 ticket.
Moral to city council:
That's the last time I ask anyone to come in and patronize uptown while the parking nazis are out.
It is just as easy to go the the Arboretum, Dilworth, South Park, etc. to have lunch.
Amazing that gangstas run wild in the streets and cops do nothing about it, but park at a meter for 5 minutes too long and they have all the energy in the world to slap you with a fine.
Hey, do like I do. Steal a car and park anywhere you like. It get's booted, so what? Towed, who cares? Steal another one to get home and dump it a couple blocks away and leave it running for the next guy.
Problem solved........later
I also moved here from DC a couple of years ago and agree with some of the previous posters that parking in Charlotte is cheap, safe, and relatively convenient compared to a real "world class city".
I get a good laugh though at the people who think it is currently horrible and inconvenient. Just wait until Levine Properties (aka Secure Parking) develops all of their land in 1st ward. They have a master plan that adds a hotel, more retail, and a bunch of residential units. You won't have to worry about paying to park in the Dixies lot or any of the others near the arena because the whole area will be developed instead of cheap and convenient flat lot parking. Instead of complaining about the garages or parking lots, you should be thanking them for letting you use their private property for free for so long.
Also, do you expect people to actually believe that $5 parking is preventing anyone from going out in the heart of the Uptown area at night? People who are dropping $50-$100 on dinner and drinks are not basing their decision on parking. That's 1 beer at most Uptown locations.
So the Palomino Club closes - what a tremendous loss! In it's place we now have McCormick&Schmicts, Zink, CANS, soon a Ruth's Chris, plus a bunch of other great places in that general area that don't seem to be hurting because of parking.
As for employer parking support...
BAC provides a monthly transportation stipend to Uptown employees that can be used towards parking or CATS bus passes, so yes, the company does help out employees other than new hybrid owners. This can be utilized via an automated withdrawl program called WageWorks which also saves on taxes I believe.
I personally pay $55/month for a spot with Secure parking in a lot on 7th Street (which I am sure will eventually disappear), and I enjoy the three block walk to my office. Overall, for me it's quicker and easier to park in a flat lot and walk than deal with a parking garage.
It sounds like alot of the issue is that anyone who has lived in Charlotte for more than a couple of years was used to not paying for parking and the change (while it may be reasonable compared to other cities) has not been taken well. My chief concern related to the changes in parking policies is that in many of the garages you can not leave your car there overnight. In my younger days, we used to drive uptown, park in one of the free garages, hit the bars, cab it home and pick the car up in the morning. I'm afraid that people are losing an incentive to be safe and take a cab because they (stupidly) think they need to move a car. I would be curious to know if there has been an increase in drunk driving since the changes have occurred.
I would like to introduce a new website dedicated to informing visitors and residents about parking in Uptown Charlotte, it's called aboutparking.com. The website offers a map of Uptown Charlotte with detailed information about every parking lot and parking deck within the I-277 belt. Also included on the website are tips for onstreet parking, arena parking and stadium parking. The parking alerts sections provides information about weekly events affecting parking and the streets which they will affect. We also have a classifieds section for renting out your extra parking spot as well as an Uptown events calandar. We are working hard to make this a valuable resource for parking in Uptown Charlotte. Check it out at www.aboutparking.com
The only time I eat out uptown is when I am going there for an event at the theater or some other cause. It is no longer a destination unto itself. I am not going to park and eat.
If more businesses (read: banks, Duke) would allow for telecommuting, this would be a non-issue.
Last anon,
I fully support telecommuting as a way to help with these problems - traffic, parking, working more efficiently, more efficient use of office space etc. However, I wouldn't try to sell it as a solution, just a very small piece of the soluiton.
Many IT people at the banks already telecommute - at least partially - myself included. I use it to avoid rush hour. Others on my team work from home two days a week. BAC is opening satelite offices around the county to be used by telecommuters. However, most jobs just don't support full-time telecommuting. Meetings ARE more efficient if you can be there in person. Conversations ARE had that would NOT be had if everyone in a group always telecommuted. Some high end computing or database work just doesn't work very well even with high-speed cable modems, and very few people actually NEVER want to leave their house and become full-time telecommuters.
Telecommuting is great. But let's not make blanket statements that are just not true.
When I lived in Charlotte, I lived in Plaza-Midwood and took the Central Avenue bus into downtown. Sometimes I rode my bicycle or even (gasp!) walked.
If more people walked or biked to downtown, Charlotte would have better air quality and fewer lardbottomed citizens.
The simple solution of for the banks to just move into the suburbs.
There would be plenty of free parking, traffic congestion would be reduced, and workers would not have to deal with the moronic street design in uptown and then be held hostage to parking lot owners.
Wachovia and BofA could move to Fort Mill or just over the SC state line and there would be all the parking in the world and less traffic (newer roads).
99% of people live in the burbs or well out of center city, so it is just dumb to have the major employers there.
Yeah, move all the banks to Jim & Tammy land and make it their problem instead. Pave all the pastures with asphault to accommodate the parking needs. Instead of distributing out of all the uptown strets at the end of the day, they can congest the country roads and subdivisions. Fort Mill will really love that. Try again...
There is nothing moronic about uptown's street design. It's a grid. It's the rest of the city's paving of old Indian trading path and deer tracks that was moronic.
Not to mention that wachovia and B of A are not going to give up all that they built in the Center City.
Getting back to parking, Charlotte's situation is still not as bad as other cities. It's just certain people having to adjust to living in a bigger city that harlotte is becoming thats the problem.
My favorite anti-parking ordinance: 2 years ago on an evening trip to the Library uptown I parked along College Street behind the library, my usual pattern. The signs said "No parking 7-5". When I returned there was a ticket and a meter cop ticketing every spot on the block. "Read the sign" she said. When I looked closely it says "No parking 7pm-5am" No parking after business hours! There is an easy 250$ to the city each day.
Pay-to-park is just another in the coffin for uptown.
Do you really think that any restaurant, bar, museum is sooooo cool that people in McMansions in the burbs will drive in and pay to see it?
Parking hurts working people. It is yet another 'tax' on working uptown.
Very few employers reimburse for parking. If you are paying $100 per month to park, that is a lot of after tax income.
I bet McCrory does not pay to park, so why do employees of the lifeblood of the city?
Move Wachovia and BofA to South Park or Mint Hill, whereever there is more space.
Stop wearing 'I work uptown' as some ridiculous badge of honor to impress people.
All 'I work uptown' means is 'I pay to park, sit in traffic for 2 hours a day, and get hit on by homeless guys looking for money.'
Contrary to the previous poster's opinion, people are willing to go Uptown and pay a few extra bucks to do it. This is the same in many other cities, big and small, across the country. Everybody who heads to the center city knows what they're getting into when they go there and have minimal objection to it. If you don't like, than by all means, please do stay in the suburbs. Just accept the fact that a lot of people don't share the 'suburban dream' and will indeed accept working Uptown and paying to park there as a 'badge of honor'. Our two big banks do have facilities in the suburbs as well, in some ways to accommodate their employees. We 'city folks' respect your choices, please respect ours.
I've started working Uptown a few month ago and love it. I haven't had a single problem commuting to or from work, I only Pay $50, and I only have to walk about 4 blocks. That being said, I think its a great idea to move the banks to the suburbs, given the amount of road construction and smaller roads I'm sure that would solve all of the traffic/parking problems. Maybe you should be a part of these parking meeting this week, join the consulting firm, or better yet run for mayor...I'm sure you would be real popular!
There are many flaws in the arguement "move the banks to the suburbs and the all parking and traffic problems go away." This arguement is obviously made by someone who either doesn't work at a big Uptown employer or by someone who just assumes that the banks would move to a suburb near their home. This is a position that is either naive or selfish or both.
First, if BAC or Wachovia moves to Southpark, then it is suddenly twice as far away from all the employees who live in Huntersville. Total miles driven would be about the same for the region, and traffic would not be aleviated much if at all. Having all of the region's major roads act as spokes on a wheel - funneling cars from all directions to a central location - is a much more efficient use of the roadways.
Second, depending on where you live and with gas at three dollars/gallon, your overall commute cost would probably be as much or more if the bank moved to a far out suburb with free parking (unless of course it moves to a suburb near you, more on that next.) This exact thing happened to my wife. Her employer moved from uptown to Pineville. Since we live on the north side of the city her commute doubled and so did her commuting expense. She had free parking to begin with, so moving her employer to the suburbs actually cost us money.
Finally, if the large employers move to the suburbs, do you think the people affected by those moves won't follow? All the law firms Uptown who feed off the banks will move to be closer to their clients, all of the support services companies will move, and many of the employees themselves will move.
So, if you live in South Carolina, or Southpark or some other suburb and are whining about the banks being located Uptown, accept these things:
1. You chose to live where you live and work where you work.
2. Be ready for a huge commute increase or be ready to move if they don't re-locate near you.
3. Be ready for a lot of new neighbors and more traffic in your area if they do re-locate near you.
Be careful what you wish for...
Palomino closed / Light Rail Parking issues/ Dept. Stores:
Give me a break. I contacted Palomino managment. It had nothing at all to do with parking. They own several restaurant chains and decided to pull out of Charlotte altogether. I live right by them. They were always busy.
Parking issues along light rail ?
Isn't that what the parking decks are for ?
Department stores won't ever open uptown because of parking? Sorry, the plan is for minoe retail to start in the next year or so and major retail a few years after. No it wont be a Sothpark Mall but we don't need that. It will be GAP, Nordstom Rack, etc.
22,000 residents in the next 3 years uptown. I think they can support thee smaller retailers all by themselves.
Stop making excuses and be part of the solution.
Walk, bike, rail, hybrid or don't bother working or playing uptown.
Badge of Honor ?
I work 5 miles from uptown but I live uptown. I would love to work uptown as well but have not found a job in my profession as of yet.
What is up with some of Charlotte's hate for uptown ?
Most people love their cities. Here it's just a bunch of complaining children. Move to the country and do us all a favor.
To "Rick":
1. It's "McCormick & Schmick's".
2. It was "Palomino Euro Bistro" that closed, not the "Palomino Club" (a country & western joint on Albemarle Rd.).
3. Zink replaced the closed Bijoux. The fact that you don't know this means you don't know as much about the history uptown as most of the rest of us.
3. CANS is the new "club-of-the-month" that will close within a couple of years, just like Rhinoceros Club, 411 (and its previous two incarnations), Twist (ditto), Alexander's, Time Lounge, Mythos, etc., etc., etc. Also, CANS is NOT a place to brag about.
Thanks for the correction. I dislike factual errors as much as the next person.
Also, thanks for providing some examples of places that closed prior to the end of free parking - Bijoux included.
That rounds out my point that free parking has little to do with the success or failure of an Uptown restaurant.
Appreciate the help and the history.
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